D&D + Chainmail - spells

[foster1941]

I was reading through Chainmail last night and decided that I'd like to use its rules for movement, initiative, etc. (but not morale -- the Chainmail morale rules seem WAY too complex) in D&D, but got to wondering when in the round spells should take effect. This isn't really addressed in the rules but the most obvious choice seems to be the artillery phase (because Chainmail's main spells (fireballs and lightning bolts) use the rules for artillery (catapults and cannon respectively)). The problem I have is that if spells take effect then except for enemy archers doing pass-through fire or split-move-and-fire there'd be no way to 'disrupt' an enemy spellcaster (which is one of the 'feel' elements I like in AD&D -- it keeps spell casters on their toes). Perhaps spells take effect in the artillery phase unless a figure has moved into melee range with the spell caster, in which case the initiative roll determines if the spell takes effect before or after the melee attack? The main thing I don't want to get into is the complicated segment-counting business of AD&D. How have those of you who've integrated Chainmail and D&D address this (or is it folly to even think of doing this and I should stick to 'Moldvay-style' initiative -- both sides roll initiative: the winning side takes all actions (movement, missiles, spells, melee, etc.) followed by the losing side taking all actions)?

[Finarvyn]

foster1941 said:

<snip>when in the round spells should take effect. This isn't really addressed in the rules but the most obvious choice seems to be the artillery phase (because Chainmail's main spells (fireballs and lightning bolts) use the rules for artillery (catapults and cannon respectively)).

Anytime that Chainmail and brown book D&D get together, it's bound to be fun.

I agree that the Chainmail moralle rules are cumbersome and I would avoid them as well.

My initiative method is to have each character roll a d12 and add their DEX modifier. Monsters can each roll or roll en masse as a single initiative, depending upon how many there are or how many different types. Then I count down from high numbers to low and let each act when their number comes up.

As far as when spells fire, why not compromise a bit. Let each side roll for initiative but have a "standard phase" where spells occur. For example, if you roll a d12 for initiative, let spells go off in phase 6.5 so that it is possible for each side to go before or after the spell. (I kind of like the half-phase numbers to get rid of tie scores, but it would be simple enough to just pick a phase instead.)

If you want to get more complex, you could have a different phase for each magnitude of spells: spells of level 1-3 go off in phase 11.5, levels 4-6 go off in phase 6.5, and levels 7-9 go off in phase 2.5. Or, you could use a different phase for each level of spell.

This would give the chance for disrupting spellcasters, as long as the initiative roll was high enough.

Just my two cents.

[Jerry Mapes]

we never attempted this.

But if it was me my choice would be go with Spell Fire going in the Arty Phase, using the rule that someone has to move within melee range to have an attempt to disrupt.

Its been a long time since i read thru chainmail but wouldnt there still be a chance to disrupt if in Arty Phase if the Opposing Arty or Archers got Init and fired first and chose to fire at the Wizard?

[foster1941]

Chainmail says that all activity in the artillery phase and missile phase is simultaneous, but I suppose it wouldn't be too drastic a change as interpreting this as artillery (i.e. spells) and missile fire are simultaneous with each other but still ordered by side (and thus the winning side's archers could attempt to disrupt the losing side's spell casters). That laves only melee as a real problem -- I think I'll go with what I posted above: if a figure comes within melee range of a spell caster (or begins the round within melee range) he may attempt to disrupt that caster's spell if his side won initiative. There'd be no chance for someone who lost initiative to disrupt an enemy spell caster (unlike AD&D) but I can live with that, as doing otherwise would add too much complication (as seen in AD&D -- requiring specific casting times for each spell + a method of determing exactly when incoming attacks occur).